Self-proclaimed Jesus man, Gov. Steve Beshear, has succeeded once again. This time, in doing with Kentucky's Christmas Tree what we thought he could only do with casino gambling. He's managed to keep things the way they were. In spite of a brief moment of universality, one where everyone's favorite Santa's elf proposed a "Holiday Tree," Beshear and the rest of his elfin staff have decided to retain the "Christmas Tree" after all.
Of course, a tree was first used to celebrate the Winter Solstice. Later, the Germans adopted it as a Christmas adornment. Today, the dead or fake vegetation (or live, if you're a real Christian) is intertwined with the birth of Christ. I know I'd be flattered if people erected indoor trees on my birthday. But, Jesus I'm not. And the Guy whose words were printed in red, but not also green, is not flattered. Palm Sunday comes later, in the Spring, kids. Save your tree homage until then.
That we continue to use a tree to celebrate Christmas is blasphemous at best. Calling and e-mailing the Governor to stand up for your faith is fine, and well within your First Amendment rights. But, could you self-righteous do-good-er's pick your fights a little more carefully? I'll get on board with banning "X-mas." Who among us (Malcolm excluded) would want to be reduced to the letter "X" on our birthday's? But to rally in support of something that is pagan mockery of your Lord and Savior's birthday? Please.
As much as this is past us now, it may not be the last of such lapses by our esteemed Governor. Prepare yourselves now for the weekend following Palm Sunday, when Beshear has proposed a "Holiday Bunny." So, go ahead and make those calls and write those e-mails. Or, if you'd rather see him fail, join a pro-Easter Bunny group on Facebook, and let the Governor continue to make empty promises. Then ask yourself, "What would Richie do?"
The issue is not the tree, but I suspect that deep down, you already know that. The issue is the continued effort to secularize our culture.
When the Governor decided to placate the ultra-left PC crowd by crowning a traditional symbol of Christmas a "holiday tree" he thought he was merely being inclusive. However, for the vast majority of believers who have tired of having our heritage mocked and ignored, the moment did not go unnoticed.
Thousands of Kentuckians voiced their opinions, and it should say something about the Governor's character that he apparently shifts with the wind, rather than stands with conviction. I really don't think he calls his tree at home the "holiday tree" and thus someone on his staff suggested a little holiday pluralism and, simply for the sake of political prudence, he thought he'd follow the advice. Of course, when he began hearing from his constituents who thought otherwise, he had another political change of heart.
Our nation's Christian heritage is unmistakable and our Founders did not apologize for it. But contrary to many on the left who think that Americans who hoist our heritage of faith as a means to indoctrinate others, our efforts to preserve our spiritual foundations do not run counter to the wishes and desires of those who penned our Constitution.
No - we do not have an established church nor do we force anyone to love God. But, as our founders did, we continue to openly ackowledge God...the one wh
im happy that things are as they should be....i dont want to look at something that is called the holiday tree thats just plain stupid...a Christmas tree celebrates christ so im happy!
Except, Right in KY, we DIDN'T have a Christian heritage. Most every one of our founders were deists, Unitarians or Agnostic. It is a lie, that is an intentional falsehood, to say they were Christian and anyone reading the works of Thomas Jefferson or John Adams would agree to that.
And before you say it's in the Deceleration of Independence it's not. Jefferson used the phrase "out creator" not "God" because he specifically didn't want to acknowledge one single religion over another. (Jefferson himself being Episcopalian, but having told Adams a Unitarian, that the only reason he was was because there were no Unitarian churches near him.)
AND, very specifically in the 1797 Treaty of Tripoli President John Adams and a Senate made up of our founders put this into the document:
"Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
So TRY to tell me we were founded as a Christian nation when the very words of our founders say exactly otherwise...
Do you really want to go down this road with me? If so - be prepared to accept the truth - straight from the words of our founders.
Let's first address the Treaty of Tripoli - which was negotiated as part of the Barbary Powers Conflict. Basically, we had a group of Muslim powes attacking what they deemed as Christian nations, which included the U.S. England, Spain, Denmark and France. Tripoli even issued a declaration of war against the U.S.
These muslim powers routinely attacked merchant ships (unarmed merchant ships) and often enslaved the 'Christian' sailors.
In an effort to win the release of these captive sailors, George Washington sent represtnatives to negotiate a treaty. The 1797 treaty that you refer to was one of many, and was an attempt to prevent an escalation of what the muslims considered to be a "holy war"
Now - pay attention that the treaty says the "GOVERNMENT of the United States" was not founded on the CHristian Religion - and in that sense - it is right. We do have a secular government, but one that was designed for a religous nation - mind you - a Christian nation.
The treaty was worded that way in order to convnice the muslim world that our government had no religious basis for continued war with them. It was our way of saying the conflict had nothing to do with religion - but with actions.
Now - if you'd like to know what our founders truly thought about the importance of religion and Christianity - read on.
"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." - John Adams.
"Without morals a republic cannot subsit any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion whose morality is so sublime and pure are undermining the solid foudnation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments." - Charles Carroll - Signer of the Declaration.
Benjamin Rush - signer of the Declartion said taht without religion "there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments. Without the restraints of religion and social worship, men become savages."
"The only true basis of all government is the laws of God and nature. For government is an ordinance of Heaven, designed by the all benevolent Creator."
"No people ought to feel great obligations to celebrate the goodness of the Great Disposer of Events and of the Destiny of Nations that the people of the United States," said James Madison - who continued. "And to the same Divine Author of every good adn perfect gift we are indebeted for all those privileges and advantages, religous as well as civil, which are so richgly enjoyed in this favored land."
"History will also afford frequent opporutnities of showing the necessity of a public religion...and the excellencey of the Christian religon above all other, both ancient or m
You know, that's why I'm not Christian anymore. Too many close minded bigots trying to push their faith on people who don't care. Good job for reinforcing that thought in me. I'll Hail Thor for your protection anyway.
Close minded?
You make a statement that our founding fathers were diests, agnostic and athiests - yet when confronted with evidence and quotes from the founders themselves that prove otherwise - you simply spout off that those who dare provide evident contrary to your claims are merely "close minded bigots." Lol
The fact that you want to erase Christianity from our national makes you unworthy of the term patriot. And if you think it's harsh of me to say such a thing - let it be known that I'm merely repeating a thought first pronounced by George Washington - who in his Farewell Address said:
Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism, who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness.
Later in that speech he added:
"reason and experience both forbit us to expect that national morality can prevail, in exclusion of religious principle."
Bottom line - neither Jefferson, nor Washington, nor Adams, nor Franklin or any of the founding fathers would have had a problem with calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree.
Great comments. But I feel like I failed to make my point - a tree has nothing to do with the birth of Jesus. That so many have been fooled by the pagan practice is astounding. Regardless of what our slave-owning, patriarchal founding fathers intended, we need to do what's right today. Or, to paraphrase myself, ask, "What would our founding fathers do?" I suspect they would allow women the right to vote and own property. I pray they wouldn't cling to slavery in the 21st century. And, being intelligent, the founding fathers might not even have a pagan idol like a Christmas tree.
That Pagan symbol is specifically a Germanic Pagan symbol. Along with the "Christmas ham" (from a ritual worshiping Freyer and was originally a boar head), Mistletoe (both the story of Loki and Baulder and Celtic belief), Santa Claus (most likely from Odin's ride with the Furious Host) and stuffing stockings (with hay for Slipnir, Odin's eight legged horse for the the Furious Host comes by your home on Yule).
I think everyone should be allowed to practice as they like...within reason. I personally love my christmas tree, stockings, and the general festivities. However, Right in Ky, Sigurd is correct. Most of our founding fathers were not Christian men. They were men of science, not religion. Having said that, I think we can all agree that this nation was founded with the idea of the seperation of church and state. I think we need to stick to that. Its not the government's right to tell us how we can and cannot practice our faith. Nor do I think our founding fathers would want to.
Bragi, don't forget that they can thank Mithras for the Dec. 25th date as well, of course if not for him specifically, the date would most likely vary some to match up with the Winter Solstice or the return of the "Sun God" (as opposed to the "Son of God"). Oh, and Right, if you review most of your quotes, they mention religion and morality, not specifically Christianity and morality.
I believe that's why the 1st amendment is stated the way it is. It's up to the individual to find their own path, Government cannot and will not do it for them.
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Self-proclaimed Jesus man, Gov. Steve Beshear, has succeeded once again. This time, in doing with Kentucky's Christmas Tree what we thought he could only do with casino gambling. He's managed to keep things the way they were. In spite of a brief moment of universality, one where everyone's favorite Santa's elf proposed a "Holiday Tree," Beshear and the rest of his elfin staff have decided to retain the "Christmas Tree" after all.
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